Debain 5.0, OpenSUSE 11.2, Fedora 12, Ubuntu 9.10 and Mint 8

[Superewza]

Several months late on a few counts but i think this is a worthy topic of discussion. The latest of the Linux desktop OS crop. It's leaps and bounds ahead of anything we had before, so much so that i'd go as far as to say that Linux OSes are now in a position where they could happily replace Windows for the majority of users without complaint. And they probably would, were it not for the simple fact that they don't know about it. So what is this next decade going to herald for Linux? With some well designed advertising i honestly think it could take back a huge share of the market.

[Ammok]

Hmm...., it's still a bit tricky making the conversion. If linux wants to bridge the gap then it has to be less geeky. Windows converts want to point and click, the only terminal my family could cope with would be a bus one.

Now if they could just do there stuff by clicking the ever familiar icons, it would be an easier transition.

However, I think the time of a linux explosion is coming soon. I've been using buntu for about six months and am very glad I made the change. The simpler it becomes the more popular it will become, and possibly force more "Big" companies to support with linux versions of their products.

Or the community becomes big enough to produce everything it needs and in turn attracts more users.

Who wants to pay for a bug ridden opsys that stops you using the hardware you paid for the way you want too.

Linux is getting more attractive with every new windows release.

[Superewza]

I see what you're saying, i do think though that people would be overreacting. You used to have to use command line for tons of stuff in every OS and nobody complained. Even to launch the OS. But isn't entering one line into a terminal easier than scrounging through pages of data? Example:


sudo apt-get install pidgin


or


Open browser
Go to Pidgin website
Find download page
Download
Follow instructions
Go through installation wizard
etc.



Even so i think for the average user there's really no need for Terminal, at least not with Mint (which is what i've been using).

**** - should have added Mandriva 2010 to the list. If it didn't use the default KDE menu then i'd say it would be a huge contender for ease of use.

[mrgoose]

Personally I think Ubuntu and its ilk are perfectly good enough for the desktop already, though obviously there is still plenty of room for improvement. We've been using Ubuntu on the desktop & Debian on webservers, without a whiff of Windows since May 2007.

What I would like to see, however, is the stranglehold that Microsoft has over OEMs to be well and truly broken. MS has used a variety of dubious and probably unlawful techniques to force OEM's to bundle its operating systems. Users should have a choice of OS when we buy a PC, not be forced to pay a tax to a foreign corporation, based in a foreign jurisdiction, regardless of whether we wish to use its products or not. I think that if the regulatory authorities finally wake up to Microsoft's shabby practices, then it's days dominating the desktop will be truly numbered.

Seems Linux-using Italians are already taking a class action against Microsoft in order to get their money back:-
http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2010/01/italian-class-action-suit-targets-unwanted-windows-installs.ars

And I think it's high time we did similar here!

FWIW, I am personally compiling a formal complaint to the Office of Fair Trading and to the European Commission for Competition based on evidence that I am gathering and documenting on my site. The only reason I have not submitted it already is that it is taking ages to write it all up. Progress so far:-
http://www.garfnet.org.uk/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=74&Itemid=331

Top marks to Novatech, by the way, for being one of the few UK computer suppliers that will actually supply computer equipment without MS Windows.

Best wishes, G.

[Superewza]

I read a story a while back about somebody getting money back on a pre-built they had by not accepting the 'you own my soul' thing or booting into Windows at any point.

[Ammok]

Not having ops sys installed attracted me to NT in the first instance, and the level of service is beyond comparison.

What I would like NT to do is offer an option for a "free" op sys with icons for the necessities already on the dektop, say FF. Staroffice etc. Then I could try it out on my missus.

I agree with Mr.G and applaud your efforts there, and I think the Linux critical mass is approaching.

[mrgoose]

Actually NT could make themselves a master Ubuntu liveDVD c/w all the kernel modules etc. using Remastersys and install this as the non-MS standard. Once they had the LiveDVD, it would actually be easier (and faster) to install then MS Windows.

That's what we do.

Best wishes, G

[Superewza]

I get what you're saying - but i really think that Mint is a far better distro for people coming from Windows.

Also, just because Ubuntu was based on Debain it doesn't mean that we should forget about Debain altogether. It's a rock solid distro with tons of packages and can run on stupidly old hardware. Sure, Arch Linux may do that well and is popular but it's really for the advanced users. ****, i barely managed to get my head round the installer and even then it booted into a command line, which i hadn't a clue what to do with.

[mrgoose]

Mint is nice, very nice in fact. And there are a lot of other very worthy distros too. I use Debian on my webservers (and anywhere else where hardware support isn't an issue). And I admire the purity and integrity of the Debian philosophy.

I suggested Ubunto as a standard distro for MS-free boxes because it is (arguably)the most well known and (probably) the best supported. But of course, folks buying an MS-free PC would be able to install whatever OS they pleased - knowing that they have not been forced to pay any taxes to any greedy foreign corporations. All Bunty would do is act as a "stop-gap" OS to show that the hardware actually worked.

I guess that as more and more suppliers wake up to the fact that an ever-increasing number of customers dislike Microsoft and are thoroughly fed up with its dodgy business practices and its poor quality, over-priced products, that an increasing amount of hardware will be shipped with a whole variety of customised Linux OS's.

Novabuntu anyone? LOL! :)

Best wishes, G.

PS @ Superewza - seeing that you are a Debian fan, have you played with The Hurd yet?

[Superewza]

Well, Mint is sort of supported by Ubuntu, since it's essentially the same under the hood.

I've never actually used Debain, i just see the advantages of it. Can't help but get the feeling that it's been kinda forgotten.

[mrgoose]

Debian is the backbone of so many distros that I don't think it will ever be forgotten. Especially when the next generation GNU kernel is an offshoot of the Debian project. Moreover, without Debian there would be no Ubuntu, Mint, gOS, Knoppix, Mepis etc. Thus Ubuntu's success is also Debian's success, IMHO.

Trouble is that pure Debian is just too pure for the real world. Sadly it seems that one still has to rely on some proprietary elements (e.g. video & WLAN drivers) just to get things working - especially on laptops.

FWIW, I kinda regard Debian & Ubuntu as being different versions of the same thing, since so many of the applications and general ways of doing things are common to both OS's. For example, when I ssh to one of my Debian webservers from a Ubuntu laptop and run apt-get upgrade, I'm not actually overtly aware of whether I'm using Debian or Ubuntu.

I like both OS's very much indeed and deploy them as-and-where I feel they are most appropriate. I couldn't really say which one I prefer because they both have a place. It's a bit like asking, "You have a steering wheel in your car, do you prefer turning it to the left or to the right?"

Obviously it all depends on which direction I need to turn! :):):-)

Best wishes, G.

[Superewza]

Different versions of the same thing? Hmm... you could say that of any distros really. But Debain certainly has its place. It's been going for longer than i've been alive and yet it's had less releases than Ubuntu. Why? Because they take so much notice of the phrase 'stable release'. If you ever see a Debain machine crash (due to the OS) then i'll eat my foot. On top of that there's over 1000 active developers and 20,000 packages, which kind of makes it a distro 'like' Slackware or some others in that it's quite spartan by default (although it's similar to Ubuntu in many respects) but it allows for so much customization. On top of that, the reason that pretty much all of the 'cut down' distro's are based on Debain is becase Debain itself can pretty much run on those types of machines (PII, 64MB RAM) as long as you change the WM from GNOME to something lighter.

Speaking of which, XFCE has come on leaps and bounds in the last few releases. The front end is quite similar to GNOME but it's got far fewwer dependancies, i'd quite like to see it as default in more distros.

Anybody else looking forward to Slitaz 3.0? From what i've heard it's got Openbox, Xorg and one of the latest kernels with Firefox and tons of other apps, with a graphical software/package manager. It's essentially Mint, but under 35MB :)

[mrgoose]

Different versions of the same thing? Hmm... you could say that of any distros really. snip:)
Well, yes and no. You see, Debian & Ubuntu are very close indeed. This explains the relationship between Debian & Ubuntu far better than I can:-
http://www.ubuntu.com/community/ubuntustory/debian

WRT Slitaz: at half the ISO size of Puppy or DSL it certainly is one to watch IMHO. I have a very old HK-built Palmax 1100 I'm very keen to try it on - though with only 64MiB RAM I suspect I will need one of the so-called "loram" ISO's.

Just 69 days to go, apparently:-
http://labs.slitaz.org/projects/roadmap/distro

Best wishes, G.

[Superewza]

frequent time-based releases, corporate accountability, and a more considered desktop interface.

The price you pay i guess. Does it really matter if you don't get a shiny new OS every 6 months as long as the one you do get is good enough to last, and gets updates regularly. That next point doesn't really apply to most users, but if it did then it would be Debain who came out on top in any sort of lawsuit, since it doesn't come with anything that could be considered the property of anybody else (as standard, the stuff in the repo's can be excused via saying that we don't force anybody to use them). And a more considered desktop user interface? It's exactly the same at stock - default GNOME.

I'm not trying to say that one is better than the other, just that Ubuntu isn't as simple as 'an improved version of Debian'. Ubuntu does not make Debian itself redundant.

Re Slitaz, it's quite impressive isn't it? More so than TinyCore i'd say since that just demonstrates the bare minimum needed for a Linux desktop OS. As for RAM, sometimes you can get around that by creating a SWAP partition before installation.

[mrgoose]

I'm not trying to say that one is better than the other, just that Ubuntu isn't as simple as 'an improved version of Debian'. Ubuntu does not make Debian itself redundant.


Indeed. Ubuntu isn't really an improved version. Just different - with different release cycles and a different support community. Ubuntu is 100% dependent on Debian. So it can never make Debian redundant - as you rightly say.

Interesting thing is that Ubuntu & Debian share some of the same developers. Moreover bugs fixed in Ubuntu are fed back to the Debian. Thus there is an interdependent, almost symbiotic relationship between the two distros. Hence why I tend not to draw any significant distinction between the two when managing our systems. Like I said, Ubuntu success = Debian success and visa versa.

WRT Slitaz, I think I'll probably go for the "loram" option. Palmax was made in 1998 and has quite a small hard drive too! What are you planning to run it on?

Best wishes, G.

[Superewza]

Well i found a PII rig in a cupboard, among other things. Has three sticks of memory (don't know what they are, haven't been able to boot it yet) and i might be able to put more in... ATI Rage 3D Pro :)

[mrgoose]

Have you tried Puppy?

Best wishes, G

[Superewza]

I have, but not on that machine. The latest versions have kinda strayed from the path i feel, it's still a good distro but as a cut down one? Not that much so... and it never seems to be able to get the proper resolution for my screen. On top of that JWM doesn't look good on it.

[jonbanjo]

If you ever see a Debain machine crash (due to the OS) then i'll eat my foot.

I'm not sure I've ever had a Suse/OpenSuse (from 9.2) box crash due to the OS either. Individual apps crash and the desktop (particularly KDE4 - although that is improving and I stick with KDE with a bit of Gnome - as well as preferring the desktop itself, IMO, kate is superior to gedit, k3b to brasero. etc.) itself can have problems.

The only thing I have against using it (as I do) for a LAMP and mail server is the short life cycle. Even though it doesn't take me that long to set one up (particularly with all the Yast utilities to help - very little hand editing of config files is needed), it would be better to have an OS that would be supported with patches for the life of the machine itself.

[waba]

i gotta say, the problem with linux IS that there are soo many distros - its hard to know which one is the best for you, and it is a bit of a pain changing to try them all. i tried ubuntu about 7 months ago, first time of using linux...aand i love it. the only reason i use Windows now is for gaming, which sadly cannot be replicated on linux. But everything else is swell.
There have been a few times iv installed a package using the synaptic download thing (nice and easy!) cos i liked the description, but the program needs to run in a terminal - i find working with the terminal fiddly and annoying...mainly cos im rubbish at using it. the less i have to depend on using it, the better!

[mrgoose]

Hmm, I know what you're saying and in my early days of Linux usage I would have agreed. But I think on reflection that I have to disagree on both counts Waba. You see...

1. Problem with Windows and Mac OS is that only MS & Apple respectively can make them. Consequently we have ended up with big, bloated OS's that are based around what the corporations can sell us, rather than what we need. And in the case of Windows, this lack of diversity (c/w near-zero competition and inadequate peer review) has resulted in sloppy security and hence made it very susceptible to malware and other nasties.

However, with GNU/Linux, anyone - and I mean anyone - can create a Linux distro. The open source model means that developers can both collaborate and compete, freely. They can take each other's code and develop and improve it and then hand it back. It really is a wonderful way of doing things if you think about it. Heck, we even make our own distro using Remastersys, basically by cherry-picking all the KDE & GTK apps we like and making a bootable DVD out of it. It would be a very sad day if we were no longer able to do this. Therefore I feel that diversity is actually a strength rather than a weakness.

I should just add that firstly just because there are thousands of distros, it does not mean you have to use them all. That would be greedy wouldn't it. LOL :). Secondly, most GNU/Linux distros actually make it very easy for you to try them via LiveCD's - unlike Windows. And they are free - unlike Windows! And finally on this point, there are many different types of broadly-compatible car, television etc. Why should there not be many different types of broadly-compatible Linux?

2. Seems to me that the terminal (or more correctly the terminal emulator) is one of the most misunderstood pieces of modern software. Whilst I quite agree that GUI's in Linux (and any modern computer OS) need to be well designed and available for all major configuration and operational needs of the end user, there are also many things that are better done with a command line interface.

For example, I agree that Synaptic is great if you want to install one or two apps. But what if you want to install say 100 apps at once? Copying and pasting a list into the terminal is far quicker and simpler than trying to find each one in Synaptic, and then ticking the box and clicking OK - over and over and over again. Example, try installing this lot with synaptic:-

http://www.garfnet.org.uk/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=193&Itemid=58

It would drive you bonkers! Again like the diversity discussed earlier, I feel that a really powerful command line interface is actually a major strength rather than a weakness. Granted, it may take a while before one appreciates this. I have to admit that it actually took me a couple of years in fact. But once you get it, you NEVER want to go back to Windows' lame DOS-like CMD.EXE

Best wishes, G.

[waba]

haha i just looked at that list of things you have installed there goose....what is in it all?!!?! i do definatley understand the bit about the terminal being useful, but there seems to be a lot of 'underdeveloped' programs where i cant find the gui for....so its more my incompetence with terminal than anything else. I really should try other distros, its just it take s soo long for me to set up how i like it, with stoopid things like the colour of the taskbars and the size of the font, that it seems like to me a lot of hassle to try others!!
what is all that stuff in your list by the way? anything you would reccomend i install?

[mrgoose]

haha i just looked at that list of things you have installed there goose....what is in it all?!!?! i do definatley understand the bit about the terminal being useful, but there seems to be a lot of 'underdeveloped' programs where i cant find the gui for....so its more my incompetence with terminal than anything else. I really should try other distros, its just it take s soo long for me to set up how i like it, with stoopid things like the colour of the taskbars and the size of the font, that it seems like to me a lot of hassle to try others!!
what is all that stuff in your list by the way? anything you would reccomend i install?

Most of the things are KDE Apps and a load of science apps, including a periodic table, stargazing software and an organic chemistry modelling tool, along with things as diverse as recipe books and a fantastic personal wiki called Zim - and their various dependencies of course. Why not try it?

WRT trying other distros, if you only have one computer then just try the LIve CD's. Don't actually install them. If you really have been bitten by the distro-testing bug then get a spare hard drive and a removable caddy so you can swap boot disks. That's what I used to do. Alternatively, get a spare computer (or two) - seriously! People chuck out perfectly good PC's all the time just because they won't run the latest Windows. Many of these machines will run Linux - particularly the lighter distros - just fine.

Seriously mate, the thing I would NOT do under any circumstances is risk messing up my main machine just for the sake of trying another distro. That is daft IMHO. Seems to me that you are making really good progress with Linux - and I know exactly what you mean about screen colours etc. Knackering up a perfectly good Linux box and losing all your settings would almost certainly set-back your learning process. Like I said, get a spare disk or spare computer - it will save you a heck of a lot of heartache! lol! :)

WRT underdeveloped apps - I think there is some truth in that observation. However I think also that many apps, e.g. rsync & sshfs probably would be less functional and harder to use with a GUI that they are from the command line. Example, there is how I connect to my media server. This lets me access all the files and folders to which I have the appropriate Unix permissions, including 6 x 1TB of media storage:-

sshfs 192.168.1.1:/ /home/goose/media-server

I can't see how a GUI could make that any easier? Can you? I should add that having executed that command, the entire remote file system appears within my GUI file manager. (Konqueror, Dolphin. Nautilus or whatever). So whilst he command itself is not initiated in a GUI, all the activity that ensues is GUI-based.

Then there are apps like VLC that has quite a nice GUI. But it has a shed load more functionality from the command line.

My view is that there is a place for both GUI and command line in a sophisticated OS. Ideally applications should offer both. But this is not always possible. Most importantly, I think one needs to avoid the "Windows mindset". This means that one should not disregard a powerful application simply because it has no GUI.

FWIW, I'm a lazy old git and I use both GUI & CLI, pretty much interchangeably, depending on what I'm trying to achieve, and what I perceive to be easiest at the time.

Best wishes, G.

[waba]

i may give it a go, although science gadgets are really bad for me, i waste hours fiddling around with sciencey things instead of doing work, so it may be better if i dont download all that stuff! i noticed you have firefox on there - iv always used it, but recently have just start using chrome. not everything is workin yet, in particular flash (which has never really worked) but it sdeems SOO much faster than firefox - pages load up instantly pretty much!! is it actually better, or is it cos iv added on too much rubbish on firefox? i only have a few add ons....
I do actually have a spare computer lyying around, perfect candidate for linux testing - any ones in particular i should try? iv heard a lot of people saying Mint and opensuse are decent.
i must admit, i am still in the windows mindset...bet hey iv been used to it for over 15 years now, linux is soo new to me!! so slowly but sure i shall wean myself away :D unfortunatly i wont ever be free of it - besides using it for gaming, my uni has windows on most of their systems - the linux ones they have are specially for physicists i think :(

[mrgoose]

Oh yes, they are a marvellous waste of working time. On the other hand, I find computer games boring and find this stuff an altogether much more amusing way to waste my time!

WRT testing other 'nix's, yes, def. use your spare system for that. Though TBH, having found & deployed Ubuntu and Debian with a fair degree of success, and made a living from using them, I very seldom flirt with anything else these days.

WRT distros to test. Bit like asking what toothpaste you should use? lol. :) There are so many to choose from and it is very much a matter of personal choice. SUSE & Mint would be interesting. Also try Puppy and plain old Debian - taking the time to read-up on the philosophies behind both.

Also the Mandriva-based blackPanther is interesting. I know the guy who wrote it. (http://www.garfnet.org.uk/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=118&Itemid=16) He's just released an English language version and he reckons it's the most Windows-like distro around. Personally I fundamentally disagree with the concept of a Windows-like Linux. I went for Linux precisely to get away from Windows. And I find the Debian way of doing things (a la Ubuntu & Mint) is more to my taste than either Mandriva or SUSE. But like I said, this is a personal choice where there are no definitive "rights and wrongs". Besides, my personal prejudices aside, bP is a very good, attractive, hardware-friendly distro.


http://www.garfnet.org.uk/coppermine/albums/2007/06/12/normal_dscf1838.jpg


WRT Browsers, Chromium has come a long way especially on Linux. It does indeed seem a very competent product. Are you using it on Windows or Linux?

Best wishes, G.

[waba]

im using it on linux, literally just started using it last week. my first impression is that it is fast, and shiney. the spare computer i was talking about is actually my mums, she has always been used to windows so maybe it would be good to stick blackpanther on there to make the transition easier.

[mrgoose]

im using it on linux, literally just started using it last week. my first impression is that it is fast, and shiney. the spare computer i was talking about is actually my mums, she has always been used to windows so maybe it would be good to stick blackpanther on there to make the transition easier.

TBH, I think Ubuntu is probably best for "parents" - especially the LTS (long term support) edition - because it is so easy to support. My mum runs it. She had a Windows 2000 lappy that died. So we got her an Explora 16 from Novatech & put 'Bunty 9,10 on it for her. She says she prefers it to Windows and is delighted that she can surf safely with it.

My Hungarian g/f, her sister & her mum all have Ubuntu on their laptops too. The language support is excellent and actually Ubuntu is pretty self-supporting. We go out to Hungary about every nine months and I give their machines a quick check over while we're there. But they do all the routine updates themselves.

Obviously we can't afford to travel 1700km each way if it goes wrong! Which is why we did not give them Windows - or a Linux distro that I did not know very well,for that matter. bP is actually Hungarian. But I don't feel I could have supported it as well as I could Ubuntu - if that makes sense?

If you enjoy an easy life, then I would put blackPanther on another machine (not your mum's) and get to know it really well before giving it to a parent! lol! :D I should also add that Charles Barcza developed blackPanther for his range of laptops. Whilst he gives is OS away free, him & his missus build computer hardware, choosing components that are friendly towards his OS. Interesting business model, huh?

Best wishes, G.

[jonbanjo]

the spare computer i was talking about is actually my mums, she has always been used to windows so maybe it would be good to stick blackpanther on there to make the transition easier.

My parents have been using Linux for a few years now. When Win2K became unsupportable,I gave them the choice of buying XP or trying Linux. I didn't give them a choice of distribution but did put both the Gnome and KDE desktops on the OpenSuse installation and let them look at each. Both preferred KDE.

They took to it very well and neither have at any point wanted to return to Windows. From my selfish POV, the "Jon why has this done that?" questions have almost (although my mother has started loosing her keyboard once in a while on KDE4...) been eliminated.

[Superewza]

Could try Mint, it's usually the 'dual taskbar' thing that Gnome has going on that scared previous Windows users away.

[mrgoose]

@ Jon & Superewza, I think that SUSE & Mint are both very worthy contenders for a parents machine. I think the key here is to choose something that you feel comfortable supporting|teaching, isn't it?

Best wishes, G.

[jonbanjo]

@ Jon & Superewza, I think that SUSE & Mint are both very worthy contenders for a parents machine. I think the key here is to choose something that you feel comfortable supporting|teaching, isn't it?

I think there was also that I didn't want to be downloading another distribution just for them but yes, my (comparative) familiarity with Suse was the main reason.

[waba]

in that case, as i am used to ubuntu il probably just let me ma use a version of that - iv never used mint or opensuse. although it means i have to give her back the screen i took off her :(

[Superewza]

It's worth pointing out that Mint is essentially Ubuntu, just a bit more polished for the end user.

[waba]

ahhh i didnt realise that. and (almost) everyone enjoys eye candy, i think i shall have a look at mint too!

[candtalan]

My parents have been using Linux for a few years now


This elderly relative is nearing 90 years old now.....
http://dnc.digitalunite.com/2009/03/31/shopping-delivered-by-ubuntu-linux/
:-)
I do not know how she types at all with the long fingernails either.

[mrgoose]

Is she a relative of yours? Nice story. Thanks for the link.

My mum is a comparative youngster at only 75. But she loves her Ubuntu lappy and feels safe using it in a way that she never did using her old Windows machine. As many of the commenters at the end of the article observed, 'Bunty is so much easier to maintain than Windows, particularly at a distance.

Best wishes, G.

[candtalan]

Relative, yes, I wrote the item, but I keep a bit discret about actual identities for obvious reasons.

[mrgoose]

Yes, I understand. It is a heart-warming story. Nicely written too. I'll send the link to my mum if I may.

FWIW, my mother decided to get broadband once she didn't have to pay for her TV Licence any more. But she was very nervous about remaining connected for long periods, after what she read about viruses, worms etc. What if she opened an email containing a virus? Or visited a dodgy site by mistake and caught "something nasty"? Besides, having used several Windows machines, she decided she that she really didn't like computers very much anyway.

So I got her a shiny new Novatech Explora 16 lappy and put Ubuntu 9.10 on it. Now she feels safe and says she uses her computer c/w the internet a lot more than the telly. In fact, she often refers to the TV as "boring" and "rubbish" and keeps ringing me up telling me about all the interesting things she has discovered, on-line! That really is quite a result, I can tell you! lol!.

Best wishes, G.

[Superewza]

She keeps phoning? So the next step is to discover email :p

That or video conferencing, but do you really want to spend all day talking to her?

[mrgoose]

She keeps phoning? So the next step is to discover email :p

That or video conferencing, but do you really want to spend all day talking to her?
She's already sussed email. And Skype, lol. Always got time for me mum!:)

Best wishes, G

[jonbanjo]

This elderly relative is nearing 90 years old now.....
http://dnc.digitalunite.com/2009/03/31/shopping-delivered-by-ubuntu-linux/

Nice one! .

[johnckeen]

well, in my thread about 9.10 not loading on my laptop. I went to try out mint 8 and it doesnt load either lol. It does exactly the same as 9.10 and stops after loading /casper/vmlinuz and /casper/initrd.lz......ready.
Any idea why it seems to do this?
Just downloaded a beta of 10.04 as well and it crashes my gfx card halfway thru install lol.
Advent 7211 1gb ram, intel celeron m 2ghz 100gb hd and ati x200m series card.

wow compatability mode in mint brings up loads of buffer i/o errors on device sr0

and after 10 minutes of loading it finally loads but freezes when i wento toclick to conect to wireless....nice!

i love this laptop :@

[Lorem-Ipsum]

I have completely switched to GNU/Linux but I choose distros based on what I want out of the machine and what works best.
For servers I generally use Debian for the stability and ease of use, I like ubuntu for general use as it looks great instantly and for other computers I like arch for the custom element.

I have tried a LOT of distros. When I first decided to use GNU/Linux at home (after using it at school for a few years) I burnt live cd's of 15 distro's from distrowatch and chose my favorites.

I still like to test new releases.

[johnckeen]

Ive got about 8 i have been trying since last week but i keep going back to ubuntu for some reason. Just finished downloading opensuse 11.2 so am going to give that a go now

[waba]

iv been looking into the legality of bundling windows with hardware - surely the EU has a case against it, like what they did with internet explorer. it is near impossible to find a large nationwide store that does not sell all its pcs with windows (novatech are not in london :( ...) and the EU supports a much stronger anti monopoly stand compared to the USA...whats been the delay?! I'm not sayiing that windows should disappear, just that buyers should have the choice whether to buy windows on top of the hardware or not.

[Superewza]

Well there was a case a while back about a person who bought a pre built pc but never accepted the T&C of Windows so got money back.

http://lifehacker.com/216393/run-linux-and-get-money-back-on-your-new-pc