Confusion over new Asus Conroe-compatible mobos

[Feanor]

I mentioned in another thread that I was going to be building a system with the AMD AM2 5000. I've now realised how much better the Intel Conroe CPU is, so I'm changing my order to that.

However I'm a little puzzled about the new Asus motherboards. The AMD-compatible ones clearly support nVidia SLI, but the Intel ones seem to have ATI compatible labels all over them. Surely PCI-E is PCI-E whichever manufacturer's multi-GPU setup is being advertised on the box, so I'd have thought they'll still be compatible with nVidia's SLI?

Secondly, the older Asus motherboards which don't support the Conroe come with PCI-X slots. The newer ones which do support the Conroe don't seem to. Why?!?

Next, different high-end Asus motherboards seem to have different features. For instance, I really like the array mic provided with the P5B Deluxe and most other Asus mobos, as I hope it will solve feedback problems when I'm using online chat with my speakers on. However the P5W DH Deluxe doesn't seem to have it. I realise I could probably get an array mic from anywhere, but anyhow I'm completely unconvinced by all this Digital Home stuff, as it doesn't seem to do anything that the P5B Deluxe and a good multimedia keyboard doesn't (I currently have the Logitec DiNuovo media keyboard and use my mediapad to control iTunes from almost anywhere in my flat).

Finally, the P5B Deluxe says it has:
" High Definition Audio
Enjoy high-end sound system on your PC! The onboard 8-channel HD audio (High Definition Audio, previously codenamed Azalia) CODEC enables high-quality 192KHz/24-bit audio output, jack-sensing feature, retasking functions and multi-streaming technology that simultaneously sends different audio streams to different destinations. You can now talk to your partners on the headphone while playing a multi-channel network games. All of these are done on one computer. "

I really like the idea of simultaneously steaming audio to different locations. It means I can listen to my music on my separates hifi, while sending my game audio to my surround sound PC speakers setup around my desk (planning my living room so that my sofas are in the middle of my hifi surround sound, and so that I can view my TV from my dining table at the same time as having my PC in a surround-sound position for use with gaming has proved impossible). I was going to solve this with an Apple Airport Express, as when used with an optical out the SQ loss is minimal, but this motherboard feature might solve my problem for me. What troubles me is that I already have a Soundblaster X-Fi - does anyone know if I'll be able to use the multi-destination audio streaming feature alongside with my X-Fi, or will I have to just use the on-board sound?

This post has become rather long, but any thoughts would be very much appreciated :D

[Taxation]

-if a motherboard has crossifre support then it wont do sli and visaversa
-pci-X is basically the same as pci-e

[Feanor]

-if a motherboard has crossifre support then it wont do sli and visaversa
-pci-X is basically the same as pci-e

1. Oh. That's disappointing. So my choice is to go for the faster Intel Conroe but the inferior ATI graphics cards, because there aren't many good Conroe-compatible nVidia chipsets, or to go for the slower AM2 5000 but the superior nVidia cards. Admittedly, I've only looked at Asus motherboards, because I've got my heart set on their top-notch reputation for reliability.
I realise you can use an older socket 775 mobo if you update the BIOS, but to do that I'd either need to get my hands on an older compatible 775 CPU to flash the BIOS or get hold of a new BIOS chip. Hmmphr. :?

2. Really? That's not my understanding... but then again wikipedia isn't always correct. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI-X

[Taxation]

they are basically the same thing, but pci-x is normally found in tyan boards (to my knowledge) and they can do sli with normal pci-e gfx cards

[Feanor]

Ahh, OK, thanks Taxation :D

Any thoughts on my Intel Conroe with ATI vs AMD AM2 with nVidia dilemma? What would you do in my position?

[Taxation]

i would get a conroe board
2 graphics cards arent what its cracked up to be, by the time you have enough money to buy a second card, a new gfx card will come out that is twice as good as the older card.

conroe 4tw matey

but thats what i would do

[Feanor]

OK, ta for that. Seems ridiculous that I can't have my cake and eat it though!! Maybe some more nVidia chipset high-end mobos will come out in the coming months. If I knew for certain they were then I'd probably wait for them.

I see your point though so I'll probably go with the P5B or similar. I just wouldn't be surprised if, by the time I have to replace my 7900GTX, all boards are SLi like the 7950 so I'd then have to replace my mobo.

EDIT: I've done some more research, and it appears that Asus will be releasing the ASUS P5N32 SLi SE at some point so eventually I will be able to have my cake and eat it. I've only been able to find vague rumours about its release date though and these imply it might be out sometime over the next couple of months. Maybe I'll wait, I'm not sure.

[Lustral]

Nothing wrong with ATI at all ;) Been running ATI cards for the past like 6-7 years :)

Any motherboard can run either one ATI or Nvidia Card , but when u wanna run 2 it gets interesting.

If you want a Nvidia Intel SLI Conroe Compatible mobo you will have to wait till August or September.

[Feanor]

Sometimes I wish I wasn't such a perfectionist! I've just compared the benchmarks of the 7900GTX compared with the 1900X and the latter just isn't up to the job. I think I'd rather wait for Asus' new mobo than spend good money on something I won't be entirely happy with. As Taxation says, I'll probably never use SLi. But I might, and if I do I'll have to buy a new motherboard as well as a new card, or invest in the latest technology.

The end of July is fast approaching. Won't be long before we're into August, and at least putting up with my old PC of mine for a few weeks more will encourage me to get out enjoy the summer!

[Lustral]

the 1900XTX reigns all in the single card benchmarks , but when u wanna go 2 or more GPUs u just cant beat Nvidia.

http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/03/09/at ... dmark_2005 (http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/03/09/ati_and_nvidias_same_day_mega_launch_mayhem_uk/page11.html#3dmark_2005)

Im looking forward to the x1950XTX with the GDDR4 RAM running at 2.0Ghz Yummy !

[Feanor]

The benchmarks I read showed the Geforce being superior in most situations. But meh, I dunno, I guess I'll sleep on it. I just don't like the idea of being forced into a graphics card manufacturer I otherwise wouldn't have chosen by my motherboard I guess!

Cheers for the help though guys :)

EDIT: Just came across this at Wikipedia:
"ATi has opened the Crossfire architecture to Intel, allowing Crossfire to be enabled on certian Intel chipsets which boast two 16x PCI-E slots. SLI, however, requires an nForce motherboard which is SLI certified (such as the nForce 590 SLI)."

That almost wants me to go for ATI. If nVidia are too arrogant & stupid to open up the SLI architecture to Intel, so more motherboards are compatible with their processors, then of course they're going to loose out to the competition!

[Chewie]

Just to clarify, PCI-X is NOT just like PCI-e. PCI-X is an updated form of PCI, providing faster speed for data transfer and wider bandwidths while still allowing the use of current PCI style slots. A PCI-x slot is backwards compatible with the older PCI equipment.

PCI-e is a totally different socket system.

[Nox]

-if a motherboard has crossifre support then it wont do sli and visaversa

wrong - type badaxe & sli into google - thats a 'crossfire' capable motherboard.


they are basically the same thing, but pci-x is normally found in tyan boards (to my knowledge) and they can do sli with normal pci-e gfx cards

wrong again :D very very wrong!!! especially the bit about pci-x being the same as pci-e. pci-x are generally found on workstation or server class motherboards, tyan make both of these, as do intel and a whole host of other manufacturers (ie anyone who makes workstations or servers)


2 graphics cards arent what its cracked up to be, by the time you have enough money to buy a second card, a new gfx card will come out that is twice as good as the older card.

I would agree here though! I'd just get the best single gfx card you can for the time being then when upgrade time arrives, make a decision on the reduced cost of its partner or selling and a single new one.

Nox

[Nox]

ATI and nvidia both make superb gfx cards, simple as that. They are pretty much comparable on most levels, so it will come down to personal choice, but... nvidia actually create drivers for linux occasionally, thats why I went that way.

Nox

[Feanor]

I'd just get the best single gfx card you can for the time being then when upgrade time arrives, make a decision on the reduced cost of its partner or selling and a single new one.

Nox

The trouble is, if I get an Intel chipset, then I don't have the option of going for the now-cheap partner graphics card later on down the line.

I've done loads more research on this issue since the weekend, and I'm much better informed than I was - but no closer to finding a solution. Especially since Asus' new P5N32-SLi SE looks to be inferior as a motherboard (stability, reliability, overclockability) compared with the Intel chipsets, judging from what people are saying about the old non-SE version.
DFI are soon to be releasing a LANParty mobo, called the LP UT NF590 SLI-T2R/G. It looks really good but it's got lots of annoying little fans that I know will make a lot of noise - no idea why they can't go down the passive cooling route like Asus!

Being a lover of the free market and of the benefits of competition, I rail against consumer choice being limited like this, with only certain mobos working with certain graphics card vendors - there is no technological reason why SLI won't work on the Intel chipsets, instead it is prevented from doing so by the drivers for various legal reasons, as far as I understand. I don't doubt that the market will prevail in the long run, as consumers revolt against being put in this ridiculous position, but for now I want to bash Intel and nVidia's heads together! Some blame Intel, some blame nVidia - I suspect it's both. :evil:

I've heard talk that Intel are planning to revoke ATI's license to build Intel compatability into their Crossfire drivers as ATI get into bed with AMD. This could be interesting, as I suspect that people will either just ditch the Intel chipsets, or if AMD can come out with some Conroe-beating competition, gamers will return to the AMD fold. Some interesting times in the industry lie ahead, methinks!


Sorry, rant over. If anyone's interested, there's a lot of useful info on Conroe motherboards here http://www.overclock.net/intel-motherbo ... other.html (http://www.overclock.net/intel-motherboards/94448-conroe-motherboards-thread-965p-975x-other.html)