View Full Version : Why go vista?
djgandy
08-08-2006, 10:43 AM
Right. I can't see the attraction with Vista. Why would anyone want it? Seem's like some people just want it because it's the "new one". Can someone tell me what it does that XP doesn't.
I personally can't see the majority of people adopting vista for at least another 2 years, probably 3.
For me, vista doesn't offer anything new. It's just going to hog memory and cpu because its got some "flashy" new interface and lots more rubbish than i don't need.
XP was an advantage because 98 was struggling with CPU support, the boot errors etc. XP has much larger hard drive support and lots of little things that were useful. Also XP Was a true 32bit operating system which is why it performed a lot better than previous versions. Also NT's stability was a massive boost.
Even so when XP came out not every rushed out to buy it. I remember you had to have a 500mhz+ CPU else you shouldnt even try and run it.
The way i see vista is the same as buying a Bugatti veyron, loading it up with bricks and lead, then taking it round a track. It has a lot of unnessesary weight.
If someone can point out reasons to go vista please do. I don't want to be left in the past, but can't really see anything in vista that would make it the future.
gwendes
08-08-2006, 02:13 PM
Security will be the selling point but I'm steering clear until I, to use your comparison, can afford a Bugati. Lots of flashy things, clever visual stuff etc. It will support those new hybrid harddrives too, if you can afford them (those are the drives that use large flash memory to make everything fast) New DirectX should be widely available anyway.
There are a few tweaks and additional stuff, like each version really, touchscreen is supported, Disk management can resize partitions without data loss...
It will be a decent upgrade but far from the massive leap between 98 and XP that most people took...
djgandy
08-08-2006, 06:24 PM
Yeah security is one of the only things i can think of. But thats only as strong as the weakest link in the chain.
DX10 is meant to be vista only, i'm not sure if that'll stick or not, but still. Even if it does I won't expect any decent DX10 games for nearly 2 years.
It's good to know disk manager will have some features finally though!
That's something that should have been done 10 years ago!
Kremmen
10-08-2006, 03:19 PM
I have a friend who works in 'Redmond'.
His current advice to me is to stay well clear of early releases. He works for the company in a technical capacity and even he has said that his main home PC with crucial data will stay XP for the forseeable future.
cost will put me off initially, then it will be the fact games will run slower (if they do!!)
Nox
barryboy
07-09-2006, 02:13 PM
Call me an old cynic if you like but I strongly suspect that the reasons are purely financial.
DJgandy has already said that there are improvements in disk manager and as he rightly says these are long overdue. Other than that this is just an exercise in revenue generation. Obviously Bill thinks that we've had enough use out of our XP investment and it's now time to get us onto the next piece of Bloatware at several hundred quid plus. I saw it through several versions of MSDOS (anyone remember paying for the turkey that was MSDOS 4??) and it's still happening with Windows.
Without trying to hijack this thread into an anti-MS rant, I would happily migrate to Linux if I didn't have to run Photoshop CS and MS Publisher. In truth, I could do without Publisher if I had to but it is a very easy to use program for which I have many templates stored.
JDowdall
17-09-2006, 01:17 PM
About the games on vista... halo 2 need i say anymore :D
ok, you mention 1 game there - now think about all the old ones that won't run.
Nox
JDowdall
19-09-2006, 06:36 PM
isnt there any backwards compatability? anyways it might only be one game but wat a game!
JDowdall
19-09-2006, 06:37 PM
isnt there any backwards compatability? anyways it might only be one game but wat a game!
Taxation
19-09-2006, 09:51 PM
Vista should be backwards compatible, otherwise no one would upgrade because it would cost far too much, just for a couple of games.
Crysis is a dx10 game, but they are currently running it on dx9 cards, and it still looks great, and as for halo 2.
Got boring for me, i want halo 3 baby :wink:
Vista will probably be as backwardly compatible as previous ms OS's re games, ie most games you play now will be ok, but older titles get closer to never being launched again...
Nox
JDowdall
20-09-2006, 05:51 PM
so does that mean i can play halo 2 on xp? oh and about halo 3 i think i preordered it in march lol :roll:
Taxation
20-09-2006, 08:54 PM
You cant play halo 2 on XP, it is for vista ONLY
Halo 3, its looking good. Cant wait to get my hands on the finished product :wink:
Yep, Halo 3 is Vista only, what I was trying to say is you will get to play a few extra games (currently one) but you will not be able to play a larger protion of your older games. For example, in Vista RC1, I cannot zone in EQ2 - fairly essential really! Though I have heard this isn't a common problem, and oddly enough could be my gfx driver...
Nox
barryboy commented that he didn't want to hijack this thread into an "anti-MS rant"... He didn't need to worry, it's been hijacked into a "gaming" rant!!!
From what I have seen of Vista I quite like it. I'm not a gamer (although I do like games), but there are a few things I have seen so far that I quite like, such as: The Start menu which doesn't have the anoying pop outs, they are now all confined within the main start menu (although if you have a lot of apps installed it may get a bit combersome - Not experienced that yet).[/*:m:3gtyob1u]
The ablity to change partition sizes on the fly - I have used this already and it didn't have any problems. (although this has been [/*:m:3gtyob1u]
how you can hover items on the start menu (and also on Alt+Tab) and get an update of the app (e.g. good if you're downloading something - the progress bar updates etc)[/*:m:3gtyob1u]
There are more but I'm under pressure from the boyf to go to bed!! So will post again sometime soon.[/*:m:3gtyob1u]Aubs
Daedalus
22-09-2006, 08:35 AM
Yes I think I'll wait a year or two until MS at least release Service Pack 1 and there are a decent number of drivers available for it. When I do I think I'll finally go for the 64bit version it seems silly to have a 64bit processor and be running 32bit windows like I am currently (I bought it before I built this PC.) And Halo 3 will only run on Vista???? Sounds like blatant commercialisation to me.
Taxation
22-09-2006, 11:02 AM
I thought halo 3 was for 360 and halo 2 was going to be released on vista :?:
djgandy
24-09-2006, 08:58 AM
Yes I think I'll wait a year or two until MS at least release Service Pack 1 and there are a decent number of drivers available for it. When I do I think I'll finally go for the 64bit version it seems silly to have a 64bit*processor ('http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/products/a561x1y0z1p0s0n0m0') and be running 32bit windows like I am currently (I bought it before I built this PC.) And Halo 3 will only run on Vista???? Sounds like blatant commercialisation to me.
Exactly what you should do. It's not worth having till it's been out and released for a good while. I know from past experience there will be a lot of bugs and problems with vista.
When the service pack is out it will be a good time to upgrade maybe.
been playing with RC1 - can't see much difference between XP and vista if i'm 100% honest... just looks a bit prettier, nothing that can't allready be done in XP.
Nox
Taxation
25-09-2006, 12:27 PM
Ive seen some gaming benches for vista, almost a 40% drop in every game (any game that would actuqally work, due to low openGL support)
well eq2 isn't 40% slower, its fairly comparable, however I couldn't zone so it came off, and I tried xp 64 to see if it was a vista or x64 prob. fortunately the former.
Nox
Taxation
26-09-2006, 08:50 AM
btw i got this from bungie.net, and halo 3 is coming to the 360
Q
What systems is Halo 3 available for?
A
Halo 3 is being made for the Xbox 360.
Taxation
16-10-2006, 09:34 PM
why go vista
when you can run DX10 games on XP
http://theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35110
no you can't:
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35140
:D
Don't beleive everything you read on the internet...
Nox
Taxation
18-10-2006, 04:25 PM
dude, that sucks
deathhaggis
18-10-2006, 08:05 PM
dude, that sucks
It does indeed. What's worse is that you still cant buy a video card that's directX10 compatible and it looks like there may not even be any on the market by the time that Vista ships next month :shock: I wonder if that;s part of the reason they're releasing the enterprise version before the home consumer version?
Not that there are any directX10 games out there to run it on even if you could get a vid card :? I think it's safe to say that DX9's gonna be the weapon of choice for at least another year.
Godfather
18-10-2006, 09:09 PM
why go vista
Well firstly I like to say hello (not wanting to seam impolite) :D
If you are going to be a first time buyer (general public) and Vista comes with it thats fine..
But if you are a developer, tester, PC nut always wanting to try different things out new memory bigger faster hard drives always going for new Mobo (think you get my drift) Well are you in for a shock..
OH ye I should mention that I am a $MS official beta tester
Here it comes now at the moment on the beta progg news groups there is a very big debate going on over the wording of the Ula and well its a can of worms Did you know Vista will only allow one hardware change and that its not the software that $MS are licencing but licencing the OS to the hardware (putting a stick of memory in is the one change) the debate is still going on $MS have not really answered anything...
Its also been mentioned that by not using Vista virus software could be deemed to be breaking the Ula (think others like Macafee etc will have something to say about that)
Even beta testers are confused looks like the days of being able to transfer your OS to different machines after activation are over so we need deep pockets having to keep buying new licences...
here are some quotes
"There is quite a thread and a lot of dismay on licensing in Cafe . for
>>> a lot of us that beta test , add parts , build new boxes on regular
>>> basis we are hooped . The one only switch is problematic . I for one
>>> will not put vista RTM on my present box as I will be going to a
>>> Conroe box shortly . Could you please clarify that one license will
>>> stay with one user and Microsoft can manually re activate ?"
"
>I agree that MS needs to explain the licensing.
>
> I purchased one copy of XP Pro when it came out. Since then, my "main" PC
> has gone through three motherboard/CPU combos. According to what I have
> read I can only transfer Vista one time which means that I would have to
> purchase it *again* for my third motherboard/CPU combo. If true, that is
> a horrible choice.
>
> If I own a license, I should be able to use it no matter how many PCs I go
> through in a four year span. I upgrade a lot and if the reports are true
> MS is making a huge mistake"
big companies I fear will stick with XP
To cover my rear this is all allegedly going on..
BTW they will be no more builds next is rtm (5744 is the last)
Yeah, been reading about that too - since 2002 i think i've had hmmm, atleast 4 motherboards, 6 cpu's, 4-5 hd's & 4 gfx cards
And xp has been fine through that time.
If MS do this, I will not be buying it - there are barely any reasons to upgrade allready, especially for someone who games.
I'm very happy at the moment with Windows XP x64, and MS were kind enough to provide me with a free 6 month license for that.
Nox
Taxation
19-10-2006, 08:38 PM
i hate ms, i would buy a mac, but all the good stuff comes out on ms
why do they have to keep jacking us like this
im not going to go vista until i see a proper reason to switch
teknokid
27-10-2006, 09:21 PM
i think ms should be nice for lonce and give gamers what they want- dx10 on xp!!!!!!!!!!
Taxation
27-10-2006, 09:26 PM
wont happen, microsoft knows that if they want to make sales, then they will have to keep DX10 to vista :evil:
teknokid
27-10-2006, 09:29 PM
which sux. coz from what ive heard vista is rubbish for games!
Taxation
27-10-2006, 09:32 PM
vista is rubbish for games because vista is DX10, and there is no DX10 gfx cards out yet
teknokid
27-10-2006, 09:34 PM
lol. im getting a dx10 card so its future proof for if i get vista!
JDowdall
27-10-2006, 09:36 PM
I think everyone knows you're getting that bloody g80 whateva thing u've made about 4 posts about it give it a rest!!!!!
Taxation
27-10-2006, 09:36 PM
You have to wait for them first.
then get enough power to run it
have enough RAM, 2GB will be rubbish for vista
nothing is future proof
teknokid
27-10-2006, 09:38 PM
well if i went for vista i would get 4gb ram :-)
zooze
09-11-2006, 12:28 PM
You have to wait for them first.
then get enough power to run it
have enough RAM, 2GB will be rubbish for vista
nothing is future proof
Thought I'd add a couple of bits here. Obviously Vista brings a load of new things with it, this includes security with a more locked down core, bitlocker, direct 10, cardspace. The releases of vista are aimed not only for compliance reasons but also for different segments of the market place.
Some of the elements of vista will benefit enterprise customers more than home users so for example, enhances IP sec, Network Access Protections, Vista single image builds etc.
However as mentioned above some will benefit the enthusiast also. No longer will vista be activated based upon hardware (like XP is) which allows users to upgrade/replace PC's and still use the same copy of Vista.
Directx 10, we will have to wait and see if this will ever be back ported (and MS say it definately wont because DX10 works differently interfacing with the HAL than previous DX versions). All drivers now HAVE to be signed before they can be used with vista, in addition all games and software for vista will only get a vista certified logo if they run in "user" mode and not as administrator.
Windows gadges and the ability to get RSS feeds streamed to you is a nice idea however we will have to wait and see how much this takes off.
IE7 is another rich browser feature, now FINALLY incorporating tabbed browsing and much much more including phishing filters.
Finally search capability is build into vista across the board and is an excellent way to find anything on the system (a much better implementation of desktop search on XP if anyone used that, but without the slowness!).
Having tested RC2 and the latest RTM builds of vista the OS is fantastic. It runs equally if not faster than XP on a number of test platforms.
During the testing cycle of vista almost every modern concievable game has been tested. So the odds a directx 9 game wont work on your system is unlikely. I can happily run X3, Company of Heros, FSX (Which is DX9 and DX10) etc.
NVidia have just launched the DX10 cards so we will have to wait to see how this runs under Vista (but as NVidia are one of MS core testing partners you would assume it would run very well :) )
well if i went for vista i would get 4gb ram
XP is restricted to ~3Gb RAM on how it addresses memory (although technically it could address up to 4 Gig in multiple page chunks.
In order to address 4Gb you'll need XP 64bit or Vista 64Bit.
Zoozer
djgandy
23-11-2006, 01:38 PM
vista is rubbish for games because vista is DX10, and there is no DX10 gfx cards out yet
That shouldn't matter since the idea of direct x is that older versions can be used if neccesary :)
You can play Cod2 in DX7 with Dx9 installed. Why? Because dx9 has all the dx7 features built in with dx9 on top. The game will be given an interface to the dx7 features, just as if dx7 was installed :>
laughingbuddha
06-12-2006, 10:23 AM
Ok on a Vista tip, firstly you can still get away with non-signed drivers. I know because I beta tested it for Microsoft and i am now running Vista Ultimate Final Release (Offical).
Also, it runs sweeet on my system apart from the screen resolution problem I am having. My Hyundai N91W (Novatech) won't go up to the 1400 x 900 res on the screen nor show the res in display settings. I am posting this issue to the Vista team at Microsoft.
On another note, one of the sales team at Novatech said to my mate the DX10 doesn't come with Vista as standard. What :shock: .....Clearly he hasn't done his home work because it does. I ran dxdiag and it reported DX10 installed and running with no issues.
I have found with the 32bit version of Vista that you can run and install any driver from Win XP. In facted there is a Run in Windows XP SP2 compatiblity mode option if an install program fails to work. God bless them!
Here's my system spec for those who are interested:-
Windows Vista Ultimate Final Release
Intel Dual Core 3Ghz (Was overclocked to 3.438GHz but too flakey in BF2142)
1Gb OCZ 533Mhz
Asus P5ND2 SLI
ASUS EN7800GTX TOP 256Mb PCI-E (Latest NVidia 32bit Vista Driver)
3 x SATAII Seagate 160Gbs
1 x SATAII Seagate 80Gb
SATA Samsung DVDRW
7 in 1 Card Reader
Black Gold DVB-T TV Tuner (Not Vista Signed Driver, but works fine!)
PureDVD Decoder (Latest) for DVD and TV playback in Media Center
In run My Movies (Latest) in Vista to play DVDs straight off of the hard driver!
I would concur, on the beta of vista 64, I had to use arecas 2003 server drivers, and they weren't signed - slightly annoying, but still worked fine.
Nox
g7rpo
10-01-2007, 07:14 PM
Why is security such a big issue, within a couple of days this OS was cracked by whitehats and with core applications such as IE7 again being vulnerable pretty well since their release I wouldnt go near it tbh.
The only possible reason to go to vista would be for the DX 10 support but not for a long time yet
JDowdall
10-01-2007, 08:14 PM
its only really wise to go with any os until sp1 its the same with all as that usually sorts all the security holes incompatabilities etc
i'm more concerned with DRM at the moment and how it will affect my music collection
Nox
i'm more concerned with DRM at the moment and how it will affect my music collection
Nox
JDowdall
10-01-2007, 09:40 PM
I think even microsoft or sony or one of those companies admitted that its way too complicated :lol:
Taxation
10-01-2007, 09:41 PM
noobs :D
Taxation
14-01-2007, 03:08 PM
bored and found this
http://youtube.com/watch?v=guK2SaMWC1o
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